Wow... Just... Wow...

Check out the insanity here, folks:

C-------- D--------

“I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.”~ Barack Obama, in his book Audacity of Hope... who is Obama really for?

V---- T-----

good question!

Grant Smith

From http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/ownwords.asp

This statement is a rewording of a passage from page 261 of The Audacity of Hope, in which Barack Obama spoke of the importance of not allowing inflamed public opinion to result in innocent members of immigrant groups being stripped of their rights, denied their due as American citizens, or placed into confinement, as was done with Japanese-Americans during World War II. The original contains no specific mention of "Muslims":

"In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly: they need specific reassurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction."

It looks to me as if he is with the American people whether they are native born or naturalized.

V---- T-----

Naturalization is the acquisition of citizenship and nationality by somebody who was not a citizen or national of that country when he or she was born.

Taxes are increasing, we can't afford to have ILLEGAL immigrants here paying nothing and not do anything about it.

So if Obama plans to stand with someone who is breaking the law then that is just one more reason why Obama's a bad president.

Thanks for pointing that out to me(:!!

Grant Smith

V----, what are you talking about??

Naturalization is the LEGAL process of obtaining citizenship. There's nothing illegal about it. Illegal immigration is the OPPOSITE of naturalization.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=d84d6811264a3210VgnVCM100000b92ca60aRCRD&vgnextchannel=d84d6811264a3210VgnVCM100000b92ca60aRCRD

V---- T-----

Oh, well you got me on that one. i wasn't reading it right. thanks for correcting me.

But i still don't agree with any of it.

http://righttruth.typepad.com/right_truth/2008/02/i-will-stand-wi.html

Grant Smith

V----. go to the library and check out a book by Mr. Obama titled 'Audacity of Hope'. Turn to page 261 and read it for yourself if you think Snopes is lying.

There's nothing to NOT believe, here. It's all in print. The only thing NOT to believe is the silly fear-mongering occurring on sites such as that which you just linked.

By the way, you DID see that even your fear-mongering site posted a correction to the quotation. At least they did THAT right...

V---- T-----

Grant, what a wonderful idea. i will get right on that.

What is in printing? That Obama is a bad president? He has lied repeatedly to our nation and we just want it happen.

And as for fear-mongering, it's better to be prepared for the worst then to be unprepared.

Grant Smith

It is not 'better' to spread lies and misinformation. C-------- posted a great Snopes article dispelling many lies earlier today. You 'Liked' it so I figured you read it... http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/50lies.asp

What's in print is the book you say you don't believe in.

You're entitled to your opinions but you should not base those opinions on lies and misinformation spread only to cause fear and win back lost votes.

V---- T-----

you are right about one thing, i am entitled to my opinion. but what i believe is not lies. what you believe is just a fabrication of what is really happening! you have no clues how much i wish you could open your eyes and see that what i believe is not lies.

yeah i read the Snopes article. i thought it was dead on. Obama is lying to Americans and some of us, like you my friend, are blinded by those lies. i feel for you i really do.

Grant Smith

The Snopes article DISPELLED the 'lies'. Almost all of them were confirmed to be fabrications. Obama's not the liar, the people who propagate those lies are.

I'm starting to think you're not much on reading.

My eyes are quite open. You should open yours in kind.

V---- T-----

I read plenty. and i really just don't understand where you think you come from telling me to open my eyes.

Obama is a liar. how can you not see this. he has done nothing but lie. and his latest lie, the tax increase.

Grant Smith

So it is OK for you to tell me to open my eyes but not OK for me to tell you the same? I said you should open your eyes because your reading comprehension seems to be pretty lacking from our conversation and I attributed it to not paying proper attention.

The article, once again, pointed to the fact that the 'lies' pointed out by the original emailer were, themselves, truths and that the emailer was, in fact, the liar.

And, as I've pointed out, Obama did not raise taxes, he let tax cuts that were due to expire do so. His only mistake was making an overly broad statement that is now being used as ammunition by his critics to fear-monger and garner votes.

V---- T-----

well hears the deal. i believe what i believe. nothing you say is going to change it. i just think that you need to rethink Obama.

He is changing the country alright. and not for the good.

Grant Smith

Your opinion, not mine.

And regardless of your opinion, everything I've said here is still fact. You can't argue against fact.

I'm only pointing out that you're scared of falsehoods perpetrated by conservatives for political ends and that your fears are baseless. However, I can only lead a horse to water, I can't make her drink...

By the way, it's "here's".

V---- T-----

i am done talking to you Grant. (thanks on the correction though, misspelled word)

and there is nothing wrong with the Conserative views. you may think you are saying the facts. but all you are doing is repeating Obama's lies.

i've heard them, don't make me do it again please.

Grant Smith

I haven't repeated any of Obama's words here.

I've pointed out that C-------- misquoted a book. You wanted to argue with me over that and I've been correcting your ignorance ever since.

1. Naturalization is LEGAL
2. Obama said he would stand with American citizens not 'Muslims'.
3. The Snopes article regarding "Obama's 50 Lies" shows that almost all of those "lies" were actually quite true.
4. You're forming opinions based on falsehoods which have been PROVEN to be falsehoods in the course of this discussion.

So, like I said... I've done my part... I've provided the knowledge... However, if you don't want to accept it, that's just stubborn stupidity. It's like denying that water is wet. Have a good evening living in fear.

V---- T-----

okay here's the thing, don't call me ignorant or stubborn!

i said i am done. don't bring me into it personally, say what i say is a lie all you want. but DO NOT call me names.

Grant Smith

‎

1. Ignorance is "a lack of knowledge" which you have clearly shown. It was not an insult or name-calling, just a statement of fact.
2. Stupidity is "a lack of understanding". Again, merely a statement of fact because you have proven through this discussion that you do not understand the topics about which you keep arguing.
3. Stubborn is "refusing to move or change one's opinion". Once again, this is merely an observation made throughout the course of this discussion. In fact, you said as much yourself when you said "i believe what i believe. nothing you say is going to change it".

I did not call you any names nor did I state anything that was out of line with what has been shown to be true here in this discussion.

Also, "I'm done" generally means that you're done and yet you keep posting.

I'm done.

C-------- D--------

Grant, you're comments are laughable.. once again! Thanks :)

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MY comments are laughable? Wow...

So, then.... I think I just lost IQ points here. I really need to stop wasting my time but it is against my nature to turn away from the opportunity to dispel ignorance and even more so to tolerate stupidity.